As churches consider what to restart, discontinue or create from scratch post-coronavirus, how *pragmatic* should we be in our decisions? [Click play to listen, or read on. Up to you!] My mate Phil has a nickname that we love to tease him with. ‘Pragmatic Phil’ we call him.
Hi Tony! I'm clearly trawling the internet to discover this old piece. Where did you and Phillip get the phrase 'principled pragmatist' from? I can't find info on where the term was coined, although it gains currency in the early 2000's, both in ESL/EFL acquisition, and global politics. I assume it was the latter?
As for Phillip's argument, his paper on it still exists on the MTS training website, although he erroneously uses 'utilitarianism' to describe it. I have to say, it's not a very good argument, and it saddens me it's still up there.
As for your definition of principled pragmatism ... you seem to be using it quite differently to how it's actually used in the real world (hahaha) ... why did you adopt the term, then? Scott Newling, btw.!
thanks for the Painful Truth. I always enjoy reading that way you reflect on theology and ministry (as seen in your thesis. Tackling both O'Donovan and Vanhoozer!)
I wonder whether using the language of pragmatism is helpful. I noticed in the discussion about the Pastor's Heart on Alpha the response was "it works". I also worry when I hear that we are to focus on outputs rather than inputs (I think Scott Newling is working on this).
Isn't what you described as theological pragmatism the same as wisdom?
Would that language help in ministry (ie we assess Alpha based on our understanding and application of God's word)?
Hi Phill -- great to hear from you. And yes, I think 'wisdom' is a good way to think about. It's deeply informed (and explicitly so) by principle, and seeks to navigate the world (and ministry) on that basis. Thanks for the feedback. TP
Loved your thoughts on the thinking between "good" and "best" which under God's sovereignty we simply cannot know. Also, being a little older, I remember, and still listen to, Phillip Jensen's 1988 EMA "We must be pragmatic" - it is a classic!
Yes, I can't remember whether he did so in that talk, but Phillip used to argue that 1 Cor 8-10 provided a theological imperative to be pragmatic -- that is, to be flexible in our behaviour/practices (in areas of freedom like food and drink) so as to not put stumbling blocks in front of our hearers.
Hi Tony! I'm clearly trawling the internet to discover this old piece. Where did you and Phillip get the phrase 'principled pragmatist' from? I can't find info on where the term was coined, although it gains currency in the early 2000's, both in ESL/EFL acquisition, and global politics. I assume it was the latter?
As for Phillip's argument, his paper on it still exists on the MTS training website, although he erroneously uses 'utilitarianism' to describe it. I have to say, it's not a very good argument, and it saddens me it's still up there.
As for your definition of principled pragmatism ... you seem to be using it quite differently to how it's actually used in the real world (hahaha) ... why did you adopt the term, then? Scott Newling, btw.!
Hi Tony,
thanks for the Painful Truth. I always enjoy reading that way you reflect on theology and ministry (as seen in your thesis. Tackling both O'Donovan and Vanhoozer!)
I wonder whether using the language of pragmatism is helpful. I noticed in the discussion about the Pastor's Heart on Alpha the response was "it works". I also worry when I hear that we are to focus on outputs rather than inputs (I think Scott Newling is working on this).
Isn't what you described as theological pragmatism the same as wisdom?
Would that language help in ministry (ie we assess Alpha based on our understanding and application of God's word)?
Just a thought,
Phill Read
Hi Phill -- great to hear from you. And yes, I think 'wisdom' is a good way to think about. It's deeply informed (and explicitly so) by principle, and seeks to navigate the world (and ministry) on that basis. Thanks for the feedback. TP
Hi Tony
Loved your thoughts on the thinking between "good" and "best" which under God's sovereignty we simply cannot know. Also, being a little older, I remember, and still listen to, Phillip Jensen's 1988 EMA "We must be pragmatic" - it is a classic!
Yes, I can't remember whether he did so in that talk, but Phillip used to argue that 1 Cor 8-10 provided a theological imperative to be pragmatic -- that is, to be flexible in our behaviour/practices (in areas of freedom like food and drink) so as to not put stumbling blocks in front of our hearers.